Who Goes? Who Stays?

[KingMilz]

I still like Williams -- he's only 22 and we don't know what's happening with Rudy Gay yet (not to mention I'm already on record as not believing he's worth a big extension). We need a defensive big but I see Chandler as a short-term option not a building block. Williams may end up being more than that.

Yeah I mean I would have prefered if we didn't get Gay if I knew it was going to take away Williams playimg time this year, but I don't know if he will ever have the hunger to be good, the thing is there is so few building blocks we could get that will help us win now and into the future. We are in a tricky kind of situation in that we don't have pieces to compete in the West but really want to without giving up our young talent which is near impossible.

 

[randymoss1881]

There's no way we could get Chandler for Williams/JT they can do better. But he would be a great fit with Gay/DMC.

 

[KingMilz]

There's no way we could get Chandler for Williams/JT they can do better. But he would be a great fit with Gay/DMC.

Assuming Rudy Gay stays IT/JT/Williams or Landry for Chandler and Shumpert? Than maybe draft Exum (never watched him) if he's a good PG or has a massive ceiling. The Knicks might have to throw in a small piece to due to financial reasons.

If Rudy Gay goes than we need to keep IT imo

 

[Kingster]

Per Grant Napier, Gay and IT are GONE. He thinks it highly unlikely both are back. When asked about his reasons for his opinion on Gay, his answer was somewhat eliptical, but it sure sounded to me that he had personal conversations with Gay about the subject. Napier also thinks it's highly likely the Kings will get a stop-gap veteran 2-guard to hold the fort while McLemore learns the position. Lastly, he said to a caller it wouldn't be surprising if the 1,2,3 and 4 starters all were new faces next year. If you want continuity with this team, it's time to start the chant: Change is good.

 

[Albatros]

If Gay and IT jump ship they'd have a lot of money to throw around.

could throw money at Hayward, Bledsoe, Deng, Bradley, (not all of them obviously)

 

[Padrino]

if both gay and thomas depart from sacramento in free agency, the front office better have one helluva plan to replace that talent. the slowly-shifting narrative surrounding demarcus cousins will reverse its course dramatically if the kings turn in yet another sub-30 win season next year. they can't afford that; they can't afford to have big cuz seething in a massive pile of losses again, waiting for help to come while the front office talks about aggressively pursuing players from the highly touted free agent class of 2015, or whatever...

there's a point at which the chip on demarcus' shoulder ceases to be useful to his development, and i believe that moment is near. he won't abide continually being snubbed by the rest of the league as the new regime stumbles about in search of their sea legs, not when he can demand a trade to a team that will win enough games so that the recognition of demarcus' talent isn't constantly saddled with the asterisk of so many losses. having "a lot of money to throw around" doesn't strike me as the kind of solace that demarcus cousins is equipped to own, not when mid-level talents like andre iguodala routinely spurn the kings--mired in eight straight losing seasons as they are--in favor of more promising destinations...

the kings need to make some level of progress towards the .500 mark next season, and watching two major assets walk out the door is not my idea of progress. that said, i rarely put much stock in grant napear's credibility, as it's long been his prerogative to cling to his extremely forced shock jock shtick. he may indeed be right, but i sure as sh** hope PDA has a trap door outta that mess if it comes to pass...

 

[Agent23]

Per Grant Napier, Gay and IT are GONE. He thinks it highly unlikely both are back. When asked about his reasons for his opinion on Gay, his answer was somewhat eliptical, but it sure sounded to me that he had personal conversations with Gay about the subject. Napier also thinks it's highly likely the Kings will get a stop-gap veteran 2-guard to hold the fort while McLemore learns the position. Lastly, he said to a caller it wouldn't be surprising if the 1,2,3 and 4 starters all were new faces next year. If you want continuity with this team, it's time to start the chant: Change is good.

I heard Peaches say that. I believe it. Not a big fan of IT but they better at least be able to flip him for some sort of asset and have a plan to replace him. If McCallum is their answer, I might gag. Same goes with Gay. At least 19 mil comes off the books and they may be able to chase Eric Bledsoe and make him an offer Phoenix won't match.

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

Yeah I mean I would have prefered if we didn't get Gay if I knew it was going to take away Williams playimg time this year, but I don't know if he will ever have the hunger to be good, the thing is there is so few building blocks we could get that will help us win now and into the future. We are in a tricky kind of situation in that we don't have pieces to compete in the West but really want to without giving up our young talent which is near impossible.

It seems like many have already somewhat given up on Williams ever developing into an impact player. Based on what we saw when he first came in and was the starter, that point of view is a mistake IMO. The young man has a lot potential to make an impact if he gets consistent high minutes at the 3 position. That's his place in this league, but he needs extended time to gain feel, flow, confidence, and 'develop'

I have a feeling he will get one more extended look with us, before any move is made

 

[pshn80]

if both gay and thomas depart from sacramento in free agency, the front office better have one helluva plan to replace that talent. the slowly-shifting narrative surrounding demarcus cousins will reverse its course dramatically if the kings turn in yet another sub-30 win season next year. they can't afford that; they can't afford to have big cuz seething in a massive pile of losses again, waiting for help to come while the front office talks about aggressively pursuing players from the highly touted free agent class of 2015, or whatever...

there's a point at which the chip on demarcus' shoulder ceases to be useful to his development, and i believe that moment is near. he won't abide continually being snubbed by the rest of the league as the new regime stumbles about in search of their sea legs, not when he can demand a trade to a team that will win enough games so that the recognition of demarcus' talent isn't constantly saddled with the asterisk of so many losses. having "a lot of money to throw around" doesn't strike me as the kind of solace that demarcus cousins is equipped to own, not when mid-level talents like andre iguodala routinely spurn the kings--mired in eight straight losing seasons as they are--in favor of more promising destinations...

the kings need to make some level of progress towards the .500 mark next season, and watching two major assets walk out the door is not my idea of progress. that said, i rarely put much stock in grant napear's credibility, as it's long been his prerogative to cling to his extremely forced shock jock shtick. he may indeed be right, but i sure as sh** hope PDA has a trap door outta that mess if it comes to pass...

I agree the team is in a tough spot right now to have a real handle on what's happening this next season. Too much is out of their hands. Fortunately they know this in advance and, I'm sure, looking at everything, ready to go whichever way they have to. They know this, they have the bucks and a supportive ownership. It's partially a blind draft for them until after July 1. Some things that "help" them are: probably can't bank on starting help with their draft pick, they know Ben is not the immediate answer at the SG, they probably know whether they are willing to go for another year with IT starting, they must have defined alternatives in mind for a starting PF. All these things we can have opinions about but can't really know.

And you are right they can't not go for at least a 10 game improvement in the win column . A tough order under the circumstances but one they know they have to achieve, and I think they will. This all makes it interesting and fun for me to watch.

 

[randymoss1881]

If Gay leaves and we strike out on Deng/Ariza than we should try and trade for Jeff Green using the number 8 pick. Celtics love Gordon and if we have him they might bite on that deal.

 

[Dime Dropper]

If Gay leaves and we strike out on Deng/Ariza than we should try and trade for Jeff Green using the number 8 pick. Celtics love Gordon and if we have him they might bite on that deal.

Dear Lord, no. They can keep Jeff Green. I'd much rather take my chances with #8.

 

[dude12]

Dear Lord, no. They can keep Jeff Green. I'd much rather take my chances with #8.

Agreed, Jeff Green would get us another 28 win season and he's on a veteran contract where with the 8 pick, we can control the contract for awhile. You trade 8 for a vet if that vet can get us to the cusp of the playoffs and Green just can't be the guy IMO. He's a decent piece not a difference maker.

 

[KingMilz]

It seems like many have already somewhat given up on Williams ever developing into an impact player. Based on what we saw when he first came in and was the starter, that point of view is a mistake IMO. The young man has a lot potential to make an impact if he gets consistent high minutes at the 3 position. That's his place in this league, but he needs extended time to gain feel, flow, confidence, and 'develop'

I have a feeling he will get one more extended look with us, before any move is made

I would love nothing more than for Williams to become a impact player I'm still willing to give him a chance but not as a reverse cause he's shown he can't do it as one.

 

[kingsboi]

Good riddance if both IT and Gay are gone. Hopefully Pete can do a sign and trade and gain an asset for IT.

 

[gunks]

We keep:

Cousins.

We (potentially) trade/dont resign:

Everyone else.


Say what you will about PDA, he's an active little bugger of a GM.

Methinks we do keep one of IT or Gay, probably not both...Which is best for team balance anyways. We also keep Landry, because he is the new KT (although not nearly as good a rebounder). Also see us keeping the Macs. But they are our best "youngster with potential" trade pieces and I can see us losing one if PDA gets the chance to trade for a good vet.

JT is gone if we draft a PF, might be a goner anyways. FO tried to trade him at the deadline, and he is becoming a malcontent. It's a shame, JT is one of our best roleplayers...Just unfortunate that due to our roster he is playing a role too big for him.

Should be a fun offseason.

 

[gunks]

If Gay and IT jump ship they'd have a lot of money to throw around.

could throw money at Hayward, Bledsoe, Deng, Bradley, (not all of them obviously)

If we lose IT and Gay....And gain Bledsoe and Deng, I will be a HAPPY camper.

 

[upinsmoke]

As for Williams I feel there is a real possibility that if Rudy Leaves it could have the same effect that it had for Toronto where the younger guys who didn't get enough burn or touches finally get their chance to show what they can do. This team has a totally different dynamic to it with Williams getting the lions share of mins at the 3. If you watch those early games of the season Pre Rudy, Ben and Derrick played really well off each other because they're both thoroughbreds in the open court. Trade for a player like "The Manimal" and then we"ll really run them out the gym.

 

[randymoss1881]

The Rockets are declining Parsons option so he will be a restricted free agent. This is great as it will be one more SF teams might want more than Gay which in turn can lower his asking price as well as suitors. If IT/Gay leave I would offer 12mill to Parsons. This also makes 5 very good SF available Gay, Parsons, Haywood, Ariza, and Deng. And teams needing a SF with cap space over 10mill Utah, Pheonix, Dallas, Atlanta, Wasington, and Cleveland.

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

As for Williams I feel there is a real possibility that if Rudy Leaves it could have the same effect that it had for Toronto where the younger guys who didn't get enough burn or touches finally get their chance to show what they can do. This team has a totally different dynamic to it with Williams getting the lions share of mins at the 3. If you watch those early games of the season Pre Rudy, Ben and Derrick played really well of each other because their both thoroughbreds in the open court. Trade for a player like "The Manimal" and then we"ll really run them out the gym.

Good point. After the trade with Minnesota, D-Will had some space to work and freedom to just play, which he didn't really have with the wolves. The vibe and energy that he gave us in those home games against the Clippers and Dallas was outstanding. That feeling disappeared after the the Gay trade and it was almost like he was back in similar situation in Minnesota.

I think he'll get a big chance this season and we'll see a lot more of this...

 

[sdballer]

Good point. After the trade with Minnesota, D-Will had some space to work and freedom to just play, which he didn't really have with the wolves. The vibe and energy that he gave us in that home game against the Clippers was outstanding. That feeling disappeared after the the Gay trade and it was almost like he was back in similar situation in Minnesota.

I think he'll get a big chance this season

He's a below average defender and shooter. Even in the games he played without Gay, he showed the same inconsistent game that relied on transition baskets to get points while not contributing much else besides above average rebounding (from the 3 spot). He's still young but he hasn't shown enough in his 3 years to justify much enthusiasm.

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

He's a below average defender and shooter. Even in the games he played without Gay, he showed the same inconsistent game that relied on transition baskets to get points while not contributing much else besides above average rebounding (from the 3 spot). He's still young but he hasn't shown enough in his 3 years to justify much enthusiasm.

No, he defended well early. Shot the ball great in his career high against Dallas. Stroke was coming around, then the rug got pulled out from underneath him with the trade and no longer being a starter with big minutes. He also showed a good ability to push the ball up the floor and set up Mclemore like nobody else did

 

[Big Cuz 15]

i like hayward's competitiveness. heard on a podcast that the jazz don't want to pay more than 11m/yr for him. don't know if he's worth that much but he's a nice consolation prize if rudy bolts. phoenix won't let bledsoe leave so no point in trying to get him.

Per Grant Napier, Gay and IT are GONE. He thinks it highly unlikely both are back. When asked about his reasons for his opinion on Gay, his answer was somewhat eliptical, but it sure sounded to me that he had personal conversations with Gay about the subject. Napier also thinks it's highly likely the Kings will get a stop-gap veteran 2-guard to hold the fort while McLemore learns the position. Lastly, he said to a caller it wouldn't be surprising if the 1,2,3 and 4 starters all were new faces next year. If you want continuity with this team, it's time to start the chant: Change is good.

if they were gonna do that they shoulda made massive trades last year so we could guarantee a higher pick than 8. smh

No, he defended well early. Shot the ball great in his career high against Dallas. Stroke was coming around, then the rug got pulled out from underneath him with the trade and no longer being a starter with big minutes. He also showed a good ability to push the ball up the floor and set up Mclemore like nobody else did

micro pizza shooter wasn't in the starting line up either. more touches for everybody.

 

[upinsmoke]

Let the record show Rudy is a average defender, Also to BIG CUZ 15 how can last season not be defined as "massive trades". PDA traded everyone he could.

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

micro pizza shooter wasn't in the starting line up either. more touches for everybody.

Derrick isn't a 6th or 7th man type of player. To get the most out of him, he needs to start and get big minutes to gain his rhythm and flow....just like he did with us in those first several games. Add in a true pass first PG and we could have something

 

[sdballer]

Derrick isn't a 6th or 7th man type of player. To get the most out of him, he needs to start and get big minutes to gain his rhythm and flow....just like he did with us in those first several games. Add in a true pass first PG and we could have something

He hasn't shown enough to justify that type of role.

 

[ShastaKingsFan]

He hasn't shown enough to justify that type of role.

They handed him that role from the first day he joined the team...and everyone liked what they saw. He took the chance and ran....until the situation was completely changed with Gay. I disagree

 

[sdballer]

They handed him that role from the first day he joined the team...and everyone liked what they saw. He took the chance and ran....until the situation was completely changed with Gay. I disagree

In his career as a starter, he's averaged 12 and 6 with poor shooting and consistently criticized defense. It was nice to see his run and his chemistry with Mac but still doesn't erase the other issues.

 

[upinsmoke]

I for one cannot wait for the post-season to end to see what moves we make in the summer. As it pertains to Derrick he gets my nod of approval and I can see both IT and Rudy NOT playing in Purple and White next season which would leave us with major cap flexibility. Ray Mac took full advantage of his opportunity with IT out those few games and made his case play the 1.

 

[ParniValjak]

People cannot bank our SF production on a few gamed Williams has played after the trade. History will show that every player "lifts" for a few weeks after the trade only to come back down to earth later down the track. Rmember when we traded Webber for the moveable pieaces? Well Kenny Thomas looked like a young version of CWebb and even had a triple double. Brian Skinner was playing by Bill Russell at one point giving us a double double with 2 blocks while he was filling in for injured Brad Miller and Collison was just putting up real pro numbers. Fast forward a few games and we are in real trouble.

Losing Gay will be a HUGE loss for us. Losing IT will not give us the proper return just like losing Tyreke only got us Vasquez. We already screwed up last off season so we are now on the watch. Cousins' and fans patience is running really thin

 

[Kingster]

Williams' effort dissapointed me last year. I saw him far too many times looking at loose balls, not going after them. There's no excuse for lack of effort, regardless of whether he's coming off the bench or as a starter. If you talk about "team culture" you better back it up and have players who are fighters with a a passion for winning, not prima donna's. Also, he doesn't have the fluidity you want in a 3, nor the length you want in a 4. He does seem to be the classic tweener. But my main concern with him is effort. If Gay leaves, there's no way you want him as the starting 3. That's a big step down.

I concur with the sentiment that if IT leaves you are probably in a similar situation you had with Tyreke - not getting back equal value in return on a sign and trade. If Tyreke got us Vasquez, what's IT going to get us? Based on the Vasquez trade, I'd rather get as many draft picks as possible in the lower part of the draft.

The only thing I'm really positive about right now is the news about the number of good 3s being available on the market. There are several of those 3s I'd rather have than Gay because I think they would fit better with Cousins, Parsons being one of them. So maybe, just maybe, Gay opting out will be a good thing and the Kings can get a better fit at the 3.