bye bye Mully!
- Thread starter PBNJ85
- Start date
I hope Karl and Vlade are on the same page if it is Vlade, as as Dave pointed out this will be another case of hiring the coach before the GM. Generally doesn't work out as we know.
But, I'd like to see Vlade take over as GM just so there's fewer voices in the f'ing room. Vlade and Karl. Two main voices on the same page and we'll see what they can do. Vivek can sit in the next room munching on donuts and sipping a cappuccino until they call him over and tell him what they've decided. Let them sink or swim but more importantly, cut out the distractions, the opposing factions and let these two go to work. And if Vlade is GM, let him fill out the FO and hire those who work under him. Know what we need more than anything? A chain of command.
But, I'd like to see Vlade take over as GM just so there's fewer voices in the f'ing room. Vlade and Karl. Two main voices on the same page and we'll see what they can do. Vivek can sit in the next room munching on donuts and sipping a cappuccino until they call him over and tell him what they've decided. Let them sink or swim but more importantly, cut out the distractions, the opposing factions and let these two go to work. And if Vlade is GM, let him fill out the FO and hire those who work under him. Know what we need more than anything? A chain of command.
I don't think that I'd give Vlade the job as a GM. What's his FO experience? He was a great player and teammate, but as we can see, all of that doesn't translate into a great GM. Aka MULLIN... Just don't understand why you'd kick PDA(whos had experience as assistant GM) for someone who's never had GM experience.
I have no clue who's been calling the shots in the FO, but I'd like to see a year where PDA gets to assemble HIS roster. I'd give him one more year. There's a lot of reasons not to like PDA, but I like the fact that he's aggressive. The Kings are involved in almost all trading rumors. PDA is obviously unsatisfied with the current roster, and I think he's looking to make changes.
I have a big feeling we will be competitive come 2015 with a better all around roster. Someone fd up the Kings in 2014, and maybe it was PDA.
If we were to replace PDA, I don't think I'd want it to be Divac though.. no real track record in a FO. I think Divac would be nice in a smaller role, but not GM. At least not yet.
I have a big feeling we will be competitive come 2015 with a better all around roster. Someone fd up the Kings in 2014, and maybe it was PDA.
If we were to replace PDA, I don't think I'd want it to be Divac though.. no real track record in a FO. I think Divac would be nice in a smaller role, but not GM. At least not yet.
things seem to getting clearer - from a Jason Jones article:
"Shareef Abdur-Rahim was [...] leaving the team after disagreeing with Mullin and D’Alessandro over player evaluations during last year’s draft. Abdur-Rahim was also known to work with Malone, which put him at odds with the power structure led by D’Alessandro and Mullin, according to multiple league sources.
Ranadive is seeking to end such discord going forward, per league sources
If Mullin were to leave,[...]It would also mean D’Alessandro would be without someone who has been one of his good friends and allies in the business since both attended St. John’s.
When Mullin ran basketball operations at Golden State, D’Alessandro worked under him."
Read more here: http://www.sacbee.com/sports/nba/sacramento-kings/kings-blog/article16859774.html#storylink=cpy
"Shareef Abdur-Rahim was [...] leaving the team after disagreeing with Mullin and D’Alessandro over player evaluations during last year’s draft. Abdur-Rahim was also known to work with Malone, which put him at odds with the power structure led by D’Alessandro and Mullin, according to multiple league sources.
Ranadive is seeking to end such discord going forward, per league sources
If Mullin were to leave,[...]It would also mean D’Alessandro would be without someone who has been one of his good friends and allies in the business since both attended St. John’s.
When Mullin ran basketball operations at Golden State, D’Alessandro worked under him."
Read more here: http://www.sacbee.com/sports/nba/sacramento-kings/kings-blog/article16859774.html#storylink=cpy
If you could get an experienced GM to work under vlade that would suit me.
I don't hate Pete like a lot of others but I don't think he's done enough to "secure" his future. His botching of the Karl hire has really damaged him.
Seeing what Karl's been able to do record wise in a short period shows he'd have kept this team honest if he replaced Malone.
Probably would have pushed us to that 35-38 win mark which would have been palatable.
I don't hate Pete like a lot of others but I don't think he's done enough to "secure" his future. His botching of the Karl hire has really damaged him.
Seeing what Karl's been able to do record wise in a short period shows he'd have kept this team honest if he replaced Malone.
Probably would have pushed us to that 35-38 win mark which would have been palatable.
Vivek is starting to show the most important ability of a top executive to admit his mistakes with the subsequent actions to correct them/prevent similar blunders in the future. And at this point all the bad/unsuccessful decisions made over the last year, except Stauskas drafting, are tied strongly to PDA from outsiders' perspective - he has to go, with how incompetent he was made to look.
At this point I kinda believe, that FO presented to Vivek, that season is lost anyway, so he should can Malone, who wasn't going to go along with the tank, promote the wizard, that won the Summer League, and just tank for another pick, while riding Corbin till the end of the year. I doubt, they expected such a reaction from everyone, but anemic season ticket sales is probably what killed this strategy. Vivek forced FO to come out with a promise of "better tomorrow", and Karl was the only one, who looked like it and was available. I think, Karl was going to be named Kings' coach in the off-season, but Vivek pushed for the action by ASG, and someone was bound to be blamed for such incompetence. PDA didn't "botched the Karl hire", he was just the most convenient figure around to assign full responsibility to.
At this point I kinda believe, that FO presented to Vivek, that season is lost anyway, so he should can Malone, who wasn't going to go along with the tank, promote the wizard, that won the Summer League, and just tank for another pick, while riding Corbin till the end of the year. I doubt, they expected such a reaction from everyone, but anemic season ticket sales is probably what killed this strategy. Vivek forced FO to come out with a promise of "better tomorrow", and Karl was the only one, who looked like it and was available. I think, Karl was going to be named Kings' coach in the off-season, but Vivek pushed for the action by ASG, and someone was bound to be blamed for such incompetence. PDA didn't "botched the Karl hire", he was just the most convenient figure around to assign full responsibility to.
When PDA's head joins Mullin's on a pike on the lawn out front SleepTrain I'm going to give a fist pump and fly back to town to throw rotten tomatoes at it.
Dude severely pissed me off with his backstabbing bullcrap, and I was exactly hoping that turning the heat up to scorching levels would cause all the fleas to start hopping off the dog. Now it turns out his little power play might have started as far back as summer with Shareef, which would make it not 1 but 2 class individuals he chased from the organization to try to consolidate his power. Well if PDA is so proud to be an (office) politician, then he should enjoy what comes next. Politics at its finest -- you pee off the wrong people (in this case the fans), you embarass your patron, well suddenly you are expendable. Ta ta!
Dude severely pissed me off with his backstabbing bullcrap, and I was exactly hoping that turning the heat up to scorching levels would cause all the fleas to start hopping off the dog. Now it turns out his little power play might have started as far back as summer with Shareef, which would make it not 1 but 2 class individuals he chased from the organization to try to consolidate his power. Well if PDA is so proud to be an (office) politician, then he should enjoy what comes next. Politics at its finest -- you pee off the wrong people (in this case the fans), you embarass your patron, well suddenly you are expendable. Ta ta!
yeah, it really surprised me. If this was really Mullin/PDA vs. Malone/Shareef from the start then I think the clock is really ticking on PDA as soon as Mullin is gone. But that would again lead to a "coach before gm" situation for Vivek and he said he wouldn't do the same mistake twice.
Interestingly, Cowbell Kingdom speculated (no facts or sources) about a return of Petrie .. maybe as an advisor to Vlade who could have been on board with the hiring of Karl from the get-go
http://cowbellkingdom.com/sunday-musings-does-a-return-of-geoff-petrie-make-sense/
Not sure what to make of this but I really seems like massive changes are coming
Carmichael Dave @carmichaeldave · 14 Std.Vor 14 Stunden
Extreme front office makeover.
Carmichael Dave @carmichaeldave · 14 Std.Vor 14 Stunden
More changes to come
Carmichael Dave @carmichaeldave · 14 Std.Vor 14 Stunden
“@kwlarson: @carmichaeldave So are we going to have another “hire the coach before the GM situation”?” My guess is yes.
Interestingly, Cowbell Kingdom speculated (no facts or sources) about a return of Petrie .. maybe as an advisor to Vlade who could have been on board with the hiring of Karl from the get-go
http://cowbellkingdom.com/sunday-musings-does-a-return-of-geoff-petrie-make-sense/
Not sure what to make of this but I really seems like massive changes are coming
Carmichael Dave @carmichaeldave · 14 Std.Vor 14 Stunden
Extreme front office makeover.
Carmichael Dave @carmichaeldave · 14 Std.Vor 14 Stunden
More changes to come
Carmichael Dave @carmichaeldave · 14 Std.Vor 14 Stunden
“@kwlarson: @carmichaeldave So are we going to have another “hire the coach before the GM situation”?” My guess is yes.
To be fair, there's a big difference between hiring Mike Malone for his first head coaching job and having him run pre-draft workouts two weeks before hiring a GM who had a philosophy bordering between nonexistant and the complete opposite of his coach's and already having a hall-of-famer on the sidelines, bringing in a VP of basketball operations a week later, canning said unqualified GM and finding a guy who'll work well with your two main dudes.
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I'm going to be optimistic going forward.
Sometimes change for the sake of change is a good thing. PDA and Mullin were snakes who put more effort into politicking and back stabbing than building a team. The fact that they were also pushing a crap basketball philosophy and encouraging all of Vivek's silly ideas doesn't help their case either.
There are talented guys out there, Vivek just needs to find one.
Sometimes change for the sake of change is a good thing. PDA and Mullin were snakes who put more effort into politicking and back stabbing than building a team. The fact that they were also pushing a crap basketball philosophy and encouraging all of Vivek's silly ideas doesn't help their case either.
There are talented guys out there, Vivek just needs to find one.
(I'm not arguing with you, just discussing your statement)
If anyone in this FO fired Malone to remotely accommodate Mullin's coaching designs,..... I can't even calculate how moronic and self-serving that would be.
Imagine having some success and obvious signs that a competitive team is forming on the court for the first time in 10 years..... and then blowing it up because Mullin wants to coach the team?
That's just so mind-boggling it's hard to think like that -
however, it might fit Vivek's crazy/creepy attachment to former players he manifests.
If he really liked Mullin, he may have let himself believe that the absurd comparison/parallels between Mullin/SAC and Kerr/Warriors could allow Mullin to magically step in as coach next year and lead this franchise to Warrior-like success (of course, we would be missing almost everything that helped to create Warriors turn-around, but hey - logic and reality don't exist in this dojo.)
I am VERY dismissive of the FO's wisdom, but even I can't believe that someone thought the season was lost by Dec 15th.
This season was not about getting a #6 draft pick.
This season HAD to be about changing the losing culture, establishing credibility in the NBA, getting Boogie closer to being allowed to be a superstar, changing the perception of the Kings as an NBA wasteland, and making us a target location for free agents to make a winner next year.
Seriously, one of the most important things for this franchise to become a winner is that we have to find out who it was that made the decision to fire Malone, and to delay the Karl hire.
Until we find this info out (and there are LOTS of insiders who have this information and are pissed at the results), we are simply painting over a rotted interior.
Whoever made these decisions HAS to either be fired, or if it was Vivek, he needs to change his approach to this business, because if he was allowed to destroy this season+ and not take blame, he can easily sabotage whatever progress the Kings make in the future.
If anyone in this FO fired Malone to remotely accommodate Mullin's coaching designs,..... I can't even calculate how moronic and self-serving that would be.
Imagine having some success and obvious signs that a competitive team is forming on the court for the first time in 10 years..... and then blowing it up because Mullin wants to coach the team?
That's just so mind-boggling it's hard to think like that -
however, it might fit Vivek's crazy/creepy attachment to former players he manifests.
If he really liked Mullin, he may have let himself believe that the absurd comparison/parallels between Mullin/SAC and Kerr/Warriors could allow Mullin to magically step in as coach next year and lead this franchise to Warrior-like success (of course, we would be missing almost everything that helped to create Warriors turn-around, but hey - logic and reality don't exist in this dojo.)
I am VERY dismissive of the FO's wisdom, but even I can't believe that someone thought the season was lost by Dec 15th.
This season was not about getting a #6 draft pick.
This season HAD to be about changing the losing culture, establishing credibility in the NBA, getting Boogie closer to being allowed to be a superstar, changing the perception of the Kings as an NBA wasteland, and making us a target location for free agents to make a winner next year.
Seriously, one of the most important things for this franchise to become a winner is that we have to find out who it was that made the decision to fire Malone, and to delay the Karl hire.
Until we find this info out (and there are LOTS of insiders who have this information and are pissed at the results), we are simply painting over a rotted interior.
Whoever made these decisions HAS to either be fired, or if it was Vivek, he needs to change his approach to this business, because if he was allowed to destroy this season+ and not take blame, he can easily sabotage whatever progress the Kings make in the future.
Based upon his track record at GSW, Mullin doesn't have a lot of good ideas. As the right hand man to the owner, he's either failed to give the wrong advice on big ticket issues to the owner or the owner doesn't listen to him. He should go.
I get why in the abstract folks think PDA could stay ... I'm just not sure that lines up with logic and real world issues. At GSW, PDA was right under Mullin. He and Mullin came to the Kings together. PDA, to the detriment of both himself and the Kings, was put out front and center as the face of basketball operations. He was out front for the basketball operations.
So we are going to fire his strongest ally / somewhat of a mentor, make him the last person of a failed regime, allow him to take most of the Malone heat, have many fans calling for his head, and still keep him on board ... with the limitation that he can work the phones and the numbers in the back but he doesn't have final say on anything, can never talk to the media, and needs to make himself as scarce as possible? He'd go from GM and face of basketball ops (as Mullin typically wasn't out front) to effectively assistant GM with the firm understanding that he's got 2 7/8 strikes against him and will be fired as ASAP if anything goes wrong?
Some people can perform well under those conditions and a lot can't. Most folks in that spot work with the prime objective of not getting fired and/or short term gains over the correct call down the road, and this team needs objective assessments and vision in the near, mid, and long term. I think PDA has to go if Mullin goes.
I think Danny Ferry will be on the market. And I think that's who we should try to hire.
While Carmichael Dave is clearly tight with several owners and generally inside the loop with the franchise, I get the impression that he's been way more kid gloves than in the past because he's been PDA's point of contact for Kings media on KHTK. It will interesting to see if the big shake up also brings the return of old Dave (Not his solo days, but regular KHTK somewhat calling balls and strikes as most objective fans see them).
I get why in the abstract folks think PDA could stay ... I'm just not sure that lines up with logic and real world issues. At GSW, PDA was right under Mullin. He and Mullin came to the Kings together. PDA, to the detriment of both himself and the Kings, was put out front and center as the face of basketball operations. He was out front for the basketball operations.
So we are going to fire his strongest ally / somewhat of a mentor, make him the last person of a failed regime, allow him to take most of the Malone heat, have many fans calling for his head, and still keep him on board ... with the limitation that he can work the phones and the numbers in the back but he doesn't have final say on anything, can never talk to the media, and needs to make himself as scarce as possible? He'd go from GM and face of basketball ops (as Mullin typically wasn't out front) to effectively assistant GM with the firm understanding that he's got 2 7/8 strikes against him and will be fired as ASAP if anything goes wrong?
Some people can perform well under those conditions and a lot can't. Most folks in that spot work with the prime objective of not getting fired and/or short term gains over the correct call down the road, and this team needs objective assessments and vision in the near, mid, and long term. I think PDA has to go if Mullin goes.
I think Danny Ferry will be on the market. And I think that's who we should try to hire.
While Carmichael Dave is clearly tight with several owners and generally inside the loop with the franchise, I get the impression that he's been way more kid gloves than in the past because he's been PDA's point of contact for Kings media on KHTK. It will interesting to see if the big shake up also brings the return of old Dave (Not his solo days, but regular KHTK somewhat calling balls and strikes as most objective fans see them).
Seems like Mullin really accepted St. John's offer!
"Chris Mullin is finally coming home.
The St. John's celebrated star and basketball Hall of Famer has accepted the job and will become the Red Storm's 20th head coach.
“He’s in,” a source close to Mullin told the Daily News, adding that he’s on his way to New York."
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/c...-basketball-coach-article-1.2167474?cid=bitly
"Chris Mullin is finally coming home.
The St. John's celebrated star and basketball Hall of Famer has accepted the job and will become the Red Storm's 20th head coach.
“He’s in,” a source close to Mullin told the Daily News, adding that he’s on his way to New York."
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/c...-basketball-coach-article-1.2167474?cid=bitly
I tried to stick up for PDA when people were ragging on his player decisions because that seems so easy to "Monday morning QB" and I thought he was reasonable, and even good sometimes. I can't deny him credit for Rudy Gay or Darren Collision. I am happy he was able to jettison so much dead wood so fast in the Gay deal. He was right about Collison although I know the longer term plan is to have Collision as a super 6th man not our playoff starter. Anyway I don't feel like he is the most horrible GM ever where personnel is concerned.
But leveraging DMC's injury to fire Malone made me hate him, in spite of having the chance to talk with him once and admiring his work ethic and finding him to be very engaging to talk to. He's an agent/lawyer who will never change his spots. He thinks the rest of us are all stupid. And he's chummy with Mullin and together they torpedo'd this season - I felt devaluing the tickets like that was like taking bread off my table for their own egos. I can't let those two off the hook for the Malone firing even to this day - I will be fine when Pete is gone because it got to be a bizarre "social media leak/crowdsource" culture that was novel but stupid and I hope not replicated under Vlade's watch. Hopefully Vlade will not be the goofy grinning dork bobblehead that Mully & PDA are - hopefully Vlade will not find himself embarrassed to be on a Draft War Room video where he is shown to be a spineless yes man for Vivek (that was the first time I really thought PDA was a loser - that draft war room video).
All that said... wasn't it obvious that Pete was being set up as the fall guy for VIVEK's ill-fated sacking of Malone? I mean that is the way it has got to be - Vivek will be protected... but I will never really believe a word that comes out of that guy's mouth... because he has just walked his guys (Mully and PDA) to the end of the plank now hasn't he. Doesn't that suck a little? Vivek abandoned his loyalties to HIS guys one by one... Malone, then Mully, and soon PDA. Holy Pace -with friends like Vivek Ranadive who needs enemies?
But, he's the boss and that is not going to change. At least he didn't let PDA & Mully linger too long before he cut his losses.
And if Vivek's mean little twitter chihuahua girl has been or is soon canned (or at least muzzled), that will complete the job of Vivek dropping stuff that didn't work. Got to hand it to him for putting his "fail fast" money where his mouth is I guess.
But leveraging DMC's injury to fire Malone made me hate him, in spite of having the chance to talk with him once and admiring his work ethic and finding him to be very engaging to talk to. He's an agent/lawyer who will never change his spots. He thinks the rest of us are all stupid. And he's chummy with Mullin and together they torpedo'd this season - I felt devaluing the tickets like that was like taking bread off my table for their own egos. I can't let those two off the hook for the Malone firing even to this day - I will be fine when Pete is gone because it got to be a bizarre "social media leak/crowdsource" culture that was novel but stupid and I hope not replicated under Vlade's watch. Hopefully Vlade will not be the goofy grinning dork bobblehead that Mully & PDA are - hopefully Vlade will not find himself embarrassed to be on a Draft War Room video where he is shown to be a spineless yes man for Vivek (that was the first time I really thought PDA was a loser - that draft war room video).
All that said... wasn't it obvious that Pete was being set up as the fall guy for VIVEK's ill-fated sacking of Malone? I mean that is the way it has got to be - Vivek will be protected... but I will never really believe a word that comes out of that guy's mouth... because he has just walked his guys (Mully and PDA) to the end of the plank now hasn't he. Doesn't that suck a little? Vivek abandoned his loyalties to HIS guys one by one... Malone, then Mully, and soon PDA. Holy Pace -with friends like Vivek Ranadive who needs enemies?
But, he's the boss and that is not going to change. At least he didn't let PDA & Mully linger too long before he cut his losses.
And if Vivek's mean little twitter chihuahua girl has been or is soon canned (or at least muzzled), that will complete the job of Vivek dropping stuff that didn't work. Got to hand it to him for putting his "fail fast" money where his mouth is I guess.
i'd be quite pleased to see chris mullin go, because i've consistently found his "advisory" position to be problematic within a front office that's at a lack for experience. it gave mullin considerably more credibility in vivek's ear than he deserved, and worst of all, his position largely insulated him from the scrutiny and accountability that a head coach or a general manager are most often subject to. getting rid of mully always struck me as step #1 to repairing this fractured front office, so if he's headed for st. john's, then good riddance...
however, i do find it curious that there is quite a bit of speculation surrounding pete d'alessandro's potential dismissal. my assumption was that PDA and george karl represented like-minds who would be able to function effectively because of their existing familiarity with one another, especially if the competing voices amongst the kings' brass subsided to reasonable levels. first you squelch mully's influence, then you convince vivek to take his hands off a bit, and after that, some semblance of normalcy and stability should result. but if it turns out that PDA is also being shown the door (which wouldn't bother me in the least), then i'd rather the kings just gauge karl's interest in handling both head coaching and general managing duties, with vlade serving in a support role on personnel-related matters...
it would seem inadvisable for the kings to thrust themselves into another situation in which the head coach was hired before the gm, especially if vivek is actually considering handing over personnel-related responsibilities to vlade. now, i love vlade divac as much as the next kings fan, but his level of front office inexperience puts him at a disadvantage when collaborating with a head coach who is as seasoned and strong-willed as karl. why actively court the danger of ending up right back where we started, with a gm and head coach who may not see eye-to-eye when this team desperately needs a unified and stable approach? karl clearly has a vision for this team, and while i may be opposed to much of that vision, it might as well be karl who sees it through...
however, i do find it curious that there is quite a bit of speculation surrounding pete d'alessandro's potential dismissal. my assumption was that PDA and george karl represented like-minds who would be able to function effectively because of their existing familiarity with one another, especially if the competing voices amongst the kings' brass subsided to reasonable levels. first you squelch mully's influence, then you convince vivek to take his hands off a bit, and after that, some semblance of normalcy and stability should result. but if it turns out that PDA is also being shown the door (which wouldn't bother me in the least), then i'd rather the kings just gauge karl's interest in handling both head coaching and general managing duties, with vlade serving in a support role on personnel-related matters...
it would seem inadvisable for the kings to thrust themselves into another situation in which the head coach was hired before the gm, especially if vivek is actually considering handing over personnel-related responsibilities to vlade. now, i love vlade divac as much as the next kings fan, but his level of front office inexperience puts him at a disadvantage when collaborating with a head coach who is as seasoned and strong-willed as karl. why actively court the danger of ending up right back where we started, with a gm and head coach who may not see eye-to-eye when this team desperately needs a unified and stable approach? karl clearly has a vision for this team, and while i may be opposed to much of that vision, it might as well be karl who sees it through...
PDA is a spineless, self-serving weasel.
The sooner he is out, and someone (ANYONE) with some acumen and experience in basketball (not just spreadsheets) is in, the better.
Preferably someone who has the fortitude to stand up for what's the right basketball decision, not what's best for him politically and what personal gain he can get out of it.
The sooner he is out, and someone (ANYONE) with some acumen and experience in basketball (not just spreadsheets) is in, the better.
Preferably someone who has the fortitude to stand up for what's the right basketball decision, not what's best for him politically and what personal gain he can get out of it.
Actually I thought the chaka thing was pretty cool, until he pissed us all off and I lost that lovin feelin. Hey, if I was his advisor I'd encourage him to keep the chaka. And ditch Pete. Definitely ditch Pete.