Kings @ Blazers (Pre-Season) Game Discussion
- Thread starter jcwkings
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The thing is if Cousins can shoot the three at a good percentage why not let him spot up there from time to time? If he is being defended by Bogut or Hibbert let those Big fellas get out there and cover him
But yeah, most of the time I like Cousins down low.
But yeah, most of the time I like Cousins down low.
Somebody watched Celtics vs Milan? The amount of space the Celtics have to operate in, is clearly bigger, than the space our starting unit has to deal with. The ball movement was beautiful to watch, but it's a lot easier to move the ball like that, when you have wide open passing lanes.
Spacing with 2k, Rondo and Cuz is a reasonable concern. Cuz shooting 3's might be the solution. But his inside game will suffer a bit.
Playing Rudy at the 4 might be our best offensive lineup. I expect Karl to use this lineup a lot and in the same kind of ways the Warriors used their super small lineup with Green/Barnes/Iggy/Klay and Steph.
Try to make a decent run with a pace&space approach and then insert another big banger and rim protector to hold the lead. Sounds valid in theory...
Spacing with 2k, Rondo and Cuz is a reasonable concern. Cuz shooting 3's might be the solution. But his inside game will suffer a bit.
Playing Rudy at the 4 might be our best offensive lineup. I expect Karl to use this lineup a lot and in the same kind of ways the Warriors used their super small lineup with Green/Barnes/Iggy/Klay and Steph.
Try to make a decent run with a pace&space approach and then insert another big banger and rim protector to hold the lead. Sounds valid in theory...
Adding something to a skillset is never a bad thing.
His biggest strength is attacking from the elbows. He can do that, because his jumpshot needs to be respected by the defender.
If he is able to extend his range, he would be able to attack from the 3 point line. Lesser talents like Olynyk are able to do just that.
Forcing the defense to step out even further gives Rondo, Gay and Koufos more space to operate in.
Not a bad thing either.
Obviously you don't want to force Cuz into a stretch-4/5 role most of the time. So it all depends on the proper balance between a pick&pop/floor-spacing role and his inside game.
And luckily our roster seems to be versatile enough to put Cuz in a lot of different situations depending on the opposing defense.
His biggest strength is attacking from the elbows. He can do that, because his jumpshot needs to be respected by the defender.
If he is able to extend his range, he would be able to attack from the 3 point line. Lesser talents like Olynyk are able to do just that.
Forcing the defense to step out even further gives Rondo, Gay and Koufos more space to operate in.
Not a bad thing either.
Obviously you don't want to force Cuz into a stretch-4/5 role most of the time. So it all depends on the proper balance between a pick&pop/floor-spacing role and his inside game.
And luckily our roster seems to be versatile enough to put Cuz in a lot of different situations depending on the opposing defense.
The thing is if Cousins can shoot the three at a good percentage why not let him spot up there from time to time? If he is being defended by Bogut or Hibbert let those Big fellas get out there and cover him
But yeah, most of the time I like Cousins down low.
But yeah, most of the time I like Cousins down low.
What's funny is most of us had Karl pegged to run small ball lineups when we wanted a big bruising lineup all offseason. He begins the first preseason game with just about the biggest standard lineup you can get with this team and we realized that it might not work quite as well as we thought. I want that interior defense with Cousins and Koufos but half of the teams run some sort of stretch type 4 that Cousins is going to struggle guarding. Add that to the fact that the lane is clogged on offense since Koufos can only play right near the basket and things don't work quite as well as we thought. You don't pull one of the best post players and rebounders in the league out of the post for Kosta Koufos. You make Koufos work around Cousins.
At this point WCS might be the guy we need to peg for starting PF since he can guard stretch 4's wherever need be. His offense will just have to be garbage points unless he can develop an elbow jumper. You need Cousins manning the paint at all times and WCS playing weak side. Plays to both of their strengths.
At this point WCS might be the guy we need to peg for starting PF since he can guard stretch 4's wherever need be. His offense will just have to be garbage points unless he can develop an elbow jumper. You need Cousins manning the paint at all times and WCS playing weak side. Plays to both of their strengths.
It's not that simple. That's the point I was trying to get at. On defense, Cousins was having trouble guarding Leonard since he was camping out on the 3 point line. On offense, Cousins himself was camping out on the 3 point line because Koufos was in the lane. Yeah you can have Cousins go inside and try and stomp all over Leonard's face but then you have Koufos out of the lane and outside his range. In turn, Plumlee is easily able to double Cousins since there's no reason to have to guard Koufos that far away from the basket.
Pretty much the same scenario like Koufos+Cuz. Starting Noah next to Gasol clogs the paint and limits Gasol, who showed in the Euro Basket versus Gobert, that he is still a great post scorer. Noah's defense is not needed most of the time versus mobile, stretch bigs. Gasol is not that bad of a rim protector.
Will be interesting to watch who plays next to Gasol.
Will be interesting to watch who plays next to Gasol.
To be fair to Leonard he has actually really developed into a unique player. He is a legit stretch 4 in where his shot is becoming money, wouldnt be surprised if he shot 38-40 percent from 3. While at the same time he still has the frame to hold up now down low, has really developed his body. Most stretch 4's are lunch meat on the block.
From the 3pt line is really too far out. Not only are guys not going not chase him, but it is just begging for him to pick up charges.
He doesn't need that junk. It doesn't add anything. In fact it subtracts. Somebody up above said adding skills is never a bad thing, but that's not really true. Having a real focus and using your strengths > than adding in extra skills. Its like a pitcher with 3 great pitches who starts farting around with a mediocre curveball. You just don't need it if you've already got a 98mph fastball, a good changeup, and a slider. Chris Webber hurt his career getting confused about 3pt shooting. Charles Barkley's biggest wart was getting confused about 3pt shooting. When you're great at what you do, then do it. The midrange jumper/put it on the floor and get to the hoop is actually more effective because he can get to the rim before other defenders have a chance to react and jump in front of him. Spend the practice time making that 18-20 footer wet, not on a 3pt shot.
He doesn't need that junk. It doesn't add anything. In fact it subtracts. Somebody up above said adding skills is never a bad thing, but that's not really true. Having a real focus and using your strengths > than adding in extra skills. Its like a pitcher with 3 great pitches who starts farting around with a mediocre curveball. You just don't need it if you've already got a 98mph fastball, a good changeup, and a slider. Chris Webber hurt his career getting confused about 3pt shooting. Charles Barkley's biggest wart was getting confused about 3pt shooting. When you're great at what you do, then do it. The midrange jumper/put it on the floor and get to the hoop is actually more effective because he can get to the rim before other defenders have a chance to react and jump in front of him. Spend the practice time making that 18-20 footer wet, not on a 3pt shot.
If he's making it, then defenders will have no choice but to jump out at him. If he's making it.
Cousins shot 43.2% in catch-and-shoot situations from midrange. That's 0.864 points per shot. That's the same points per shot that a 28.8% three point shooter gives you. There's no reason not to spot up one step backwards if its a higher value shot. The idea that Boogie would be devastating off the dribble from midrange but an offensive foul magnet with a couple feet extra to go is absurd. It takes half a second to cover that ground for Boogie, and there is more space for him to maneuver into the paint off the dribble. A drive off a midrange pumpfake means Boogie's man is still much closer to the rim and in a better position to recover instead. Not to mention the inherent value in dragging rim protectors further away from the paint for everybody else on the team.
So far, Boogie has shown no ability to hit that shot, but there is no harm in using preseason to test it out.
Cousins shot 43.2% in catch-and-shoot situations from midrange. That's 0.864 points per shot. That's the same points per shot that a 28.8% three point shooter gives you. There's no reason not to spot up one step backwards if its a higher value shot. The idea that Boogie would be devastating off the dribble from midrange but an offensive foul magnet with a couple feet extra to go is absurd. It takes half a second to cover that ground for Boogie, and there is more space for him to maneuver into the paint off the dribble. A drive off a midrange pumpfake means Boogie's man is still much closer to the rim and in a better position to recover instead. Not to mention the inherent value in dragging rim protectors further away from the paint for everybody else on the team.
So far, Boogie has shown no ability to hit that shot, but there is no harm in using preseason to test it out.
Just a point of order:
Cousins was 5 for 6 in the Kentucky alumni game, and he was shooting some of them from 3 ft behind the line IIRC.
He has not shown he can hit them in any NBA game yet, however.
But if he could get OK with it (and he has a good shot), he's likely only going to shoot them when he's wide open.
A wide-open 3 pt shooter who shoots > 36 %?
Not impossible for him to get to, IMO.
Oh, and he's a lot less likely IMO to get offensive fouls called against him when he's shooting a 3.
This is of course theory-ball, because in practice Brick is right - it just messes up guy's heads and makes most people less impactful in their bread-and-butter game.
Cousins was 5 for 6 in the Kentucky alumni game, and he was shooting some of them from 3 ft behind the line IIRC.
He has not shown he can hit them in any NBA game yet, however.
But if he could get OK with it (and he has a good shot), he's likely only going to shoot them when he's wide open.
A wide-open 3 pt shooter who shoots > 36 %?
Not impossible for him to get to, IMO.
Oh, and he's a lot less likely IMO to get offensive fouls called against him when he's shooting a 3.
This is of course theory-ball, because in practice Brick is right - it just messes up guy's heads and makes most people less impactful in their bread-and-butter game.
The problem I have with Boogie taking more three's isn't so much him just taking them. It's that big men get lazy and they float out to the three line. It's not like it's either a three or a post-up down low. A lot of times he'll be floating out at the three line and won't get the ball, instead of establishing position underneathh. It also puts him out of position for an offensive rebound. Plenty of good post players (Pau, Rasheed, and Barkley are a few names that come to mind) are great post players that lessened their games by going out to the three point line are a few names that come to mind). Keep Boog down low.
I think big man shooting is a statistics problem.
It is very rare to be tall, and increasingly more rare the taller you get. Above 7', the odds are pretty significant that you will be playing professional basketball, regardless of athleticism or skill level (a la Greg Ostertag.)
Say that 12% of the population has the potential hand-eye coordination to be able to knock down a three point shot regularly after thousands of hours of practice. That statistic should track with big men.
Bigs are most valuable on the inside, where their size and strength keep guards and lesser forwards from running rampant. So the vast majority of big men spend their time running Mikan drills and practicing power moves from the high and low post instead of shots from further out.
So you get a combination of more and more big men getting into the league because BIG, and less time practicing those outside shots because there is no need.
It is very rare to be tall, and increasingly more rare the taller you get. Above 7', the odds are pretty significant that you will be playing professional basketball, regardless of athleticism or skill level (a la Greg Ostertag.)
Say that 12% of the population has the potential hand-eye coordination to be able to knock down a three point shot regularly after thousands of hours of practice. That statistic should track with big men.
Bigs are most valuable on the inside, where their size and strength keep guards and lesser forwards from running rampant. So the vast majority of big men spend their time running Mikan drills and practicing power moves from the high and low post instead of shots from further out.
So you get a combination of more and more big men getting into the league because BIG, and less time practicing those outside shots because there is no need.