The Sacramento A's Are Happening 2025-2027 (at least)
- Thread starter Tetsujin
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Can this really happen? I would say that 14,000 seats is comically small for an MLB team, but a sell-out every night (and you'd figure they would sell out every night) would be about 4K more tickets sold than the A's have been averaging the last few years. Of course, then what happens to the River Cats? I can't imagine they would be able to schedule both teams.
Also, I suspect that the minor-league facilities would be subpar for MLB teams (the visitors would likely be reasonably upset about the clubhouse) but then again I'm not sure that the Coliseum is all that great itself.
Also, I suspect that the minor-league facilities would be subpar for MLB teams (the visitors would likely be reasonably upset about the clubhouse) but then again I'm not sure that the Coliseum is all that great itself.
There would seem to be a lot of complications, but I think they could probably work it out. Facilities seems like an issue, but what would they do if, say, an earthquake damaged the Coliseum to the point where it couldn't be used for a few years (ignoring the whole relocation thing)? They'd have to find a backup location like this, but perhaps they would be looking at a nice college facility instead?
Maybe part of the deal would be improving the River Cats clubhouse facilities to be more suitable? I could definitely see River Cats ownership wanting to fill that facility another 82 times a year, even if it was the A's playing there (given that the River Cats are the Giants AAA team).
I mean, players are sent down for rehab assignments, etc., all the time. The facilities can't be THAT bad given what those in the older stadiums are like, can they?
I'm a Giants fan and hate the fact that the A's ownership sucks and that they are trying to hightail the team out of town, but I'd go see some A's games at Sutter Health Park (especially the Giants)!
I have some friends who are A's fans who would definitely go.
Maybe part of the deal would be improving the River Cats clubhouse facilities to be more suitable? I could definitely see River Cats ownership wanting to fill that facility another 82 times a year, even if it was the A's playing there (given that the River Cats are the Giants AAA team).
I mean, players are sent down for rehab assignments, etc., all the time. The facilities can't be THAT bad given what those in the older stadiums are like, can they?
I'm a Giants fan and hate the fact that the A's ownership sucks and that they are trying to hightail the team out of town, but I'd go see some A's games at Sutter Health Park (especially the Giants)!
I have some friends who are A's fans who would definitely go.
Wasn’t one of the other alternatives floated sharing Oracle with the Giants? If they can make two major league teams sharing a field work, schedule wise, I’d guess they could figure out a way to make it work with a minor league team.
I’d guess some upgrades to locker rooms and other fixtures might be required, but perhaps if the A’s (or more likely, the league) paid for it maybe the Giants are willing to go along with it, since the River Cats would benefit as well.
I’m not sure if Sacramento could sustain a major league team for 81 games a year long term, but I would think we could at least match the A’s recent year averages.
I’d guess some upgrades to locker rooms and other fixtures might be required, but perhaps if the A’s (or more likely, the league) paid for it maybe the Giants are willing to go along with it, since the River Cats would benefit as well.
I’m not sure if Sacramento could sustain a major league team for 81 games a year long term, but I would think we could at least match the A’s recent year averages.
When news first broke a month or so ago about SAC being visited by the A’s front office/ownership, I figured the odds were long. Especially given Salt Lake’s enthusiasm and new minor league venue.
To hear today that SAC might be the front runner is, well, a bit surprising. I’ll believe it when I see it, but still cool news.
Lastly, since the A’s wouldn’t move in to Raley Field Sutter Health Park until 2025, my guess is that’s plenty of time for modifications to make the venue reach the lowest bar of acceptability. With the outfield amphitheater style seating, they can probably get attendance closer to 15-20K?
I, too, will be attending many games if this happens.
To hear today that SAC might be the front runner is, well, a bit surprising. I’ll believe it when I see it, but still cool news.
Lastly, since the A’s wouldn’t move in to Raley Field Sutter Health Park until 2025, my guess is that’s plenty of time for modifications to make the venue reach the lowest bar of acceptability. With the outfield amphitheater style seating, they can probably get attendance closer to 15-20K?
I, too, will be attending many games if this happens.
I think Carmichael Dave has a pretty good position on this: pretty hard to support helping a team relocate after what Kings fans went through. Feels pretty icky especially considering it would be helping the worst owner in the MLB. Imagine if Golden State offered to house the Kings for 2 years while a new arena in Seattle was being finished. I don’t blame the city for pursuing this, it’s a homerun, just doesn’t seem quite right.
I couldn't disagree more with Dave. Totally different situations. Completely.
One, SAC temporarily hosting the A's (or not doing it) isn't going to change the A's leaving Oakland. Period. If SAC doesn't take them in, Salt Lake or some place else will. So why not get the benefit for a few years and show the MLB that this city can support that sport/league? I see zero downside.
Two, the KINGS ordeal happened to a fanbase that deeply supported the team. Despite years and years of BAD basketball. And a claustrophobic, aging arena. The A's fanbase is nothing like the KINGS fanbase. Not even close. Some great fans, no doubt. But not like the KINGS.
As a fan tortured throughout that relocation saga, I don't feel anywhere near as sympathetic for A's fans as I do Seattle fans, and KINGS fans circa 2011-2013.
One, SAC temporarily hosting the A's (or not doing it) isn't going to change the A's leaving Oakland. Period. If SAC doesn't take them in, Salt Lake or some place else will. So why not get the benefit for a few years and show the MLB that this city can support that sport/league? I see zero downside.
Two, the KINGS ordeal happened to a fanbase that deeply supported the team. Despite years and years of BAD basketball. And a claustrophobic, aging arena. The A's fanbase is nothing like the KINGS fanbase. Not even close. Some great fans, no doubt. But not like the KINGS.
As a fan tortured throughout that relocation saga, I don't feel anywhere near as sympathetic for A's fans as I do Seattle fans, and KINGS fans circa 2011-2013.
You're just flat out wrong. Throughout the 90s the A's in Oakland routinely were top 10 in attendance for all of MLB. At their peak in1990 they ranked 3rd in MLB in attendance behind only the Dodgers and Blue Jays.
The recent downturn in fan interest (recent in the sense that this is a team with 55 years of history in the East Bay) coincides with John Fisher taking over the team in 2005 and forcing his front office to strip the team of all its star players every 4 or 5 years because he's too cheap to field even a league average payroll. During a period of time in which the average payroll in MLB has increased from $60 million to $150 million John Fisher's A's have never -- not even once -- invested in signing a top free agent. Of the many All-Stars drafted and developed within their farm system, none of them were retained beyond their arbitration years. None of them. Can you imagine being a fan of a team who has routinely traded all of their star players before they even reached their prime?
Despite all of that, the A's fanbase is just as passionate as the Kings fanbase. We have nothing to do with an owner who refuses to pay basic maintenance costs on his own facility. The Oakland Coliseum opened in 1966, 4 years after Dodger Stadium. One of these facilities is home to a model organization who just signed the biggest contract in MLB history and it's state of the art because ownership has invested over a billion dollars in renovation costs over the years to keep it up to date. The Coliseum is a decaying wreck because Fisher has allowed it to become that way. We have nothing to do with John Fisher's failed stadium projects in Fremont, San Jose, and Laney College. Rob Manfred keeps pointing to the coliseum as the problem in Oakland -- that is a John Fisher created problem.
However you justify it to yourself is your business. Relocation has already been approved and the only thing standing in the way of the Las Vegas A's becoming a reality now is John Fisher actually spending money. I'll believe that when I see it. It just pisses me off when people throw out this completely baseless argument that Oakland has not supported the A's and deserves to lose them. The city of Oakland has done everything the A's asked them to do in the process of clearing out oceanfront property, granting the A's exclusive negotiating rights to that property, defeating multiple lawsuits and raising half a billion dollars in financing to cover the needed infrastructure improvements. And the fans? The last time the A's were good (2019) they drew 54,000 fans to see them lose in the Wild Card game. That's 10,000 more fans than have ever witnessed a SF Giants playoff game in Pac Bell / AT&T / Oracle Ballpark.
The recent downturn in fan interest (recent in the sense that this is a team with 55 years of history in the East Bay) coincides with John Fisher taking over the team in 2005 and forcing his front office to strip the team of all its star players every 4 or 5 years because he's too cheap to field even a league average payroll. During a period of time in which the average payroll in MLB has increased from $60 million to $150 million John Fisher's A's have never -- not even once -- invested in signing a top free agent. Of the many All-Stars drafted and developed within their farm system, none of them were retained beyond their arbitration years. None of them. Can you imagine being a fan of a team who has routinely traded all of their star players before they even reached their prime?
Despite all of that, the A's fanbase is just as passionate as the Kings fanbase. We have nothing to do with an owner who refuses to pay basic maintenance costs on his own facility. The Oakland Coliseum opened in 1966, 4 years after Dodger Stadium. One of these facilities is home to a model organization who just signed the biggest contract in MLB history and it's state of the art because ownership has invested over a billion dollars in renovation costs over the years to keep it up to date. The Coliseum is a decaying wreck because Fisher has allowed it to become that way. We have nothing to do with John Fisher's failed stadium projects in Fremont, San Jose, and Laney College. Rob Manfred keeps pointing to the coliseum as the problem in Oakland -- that is a John Fisher created problem.
However you justify it to yourself is your business. Relocation has already been approved and the only thing standing in the way of the Las Vegas A's becoming a reality now is John Fisher actually spending money. I'll believe that when I see it. It just pisses me off when people throw out this completely baseless argument that Oakland has not supported the A's and deserves to lose them. The city of Oakland has done everything the A's asked them to do in the process of clearing out oceanfront property, granting the A's exclusive negotiating rights to that property, defeating multiple lawsuits and raising half a billion dollars in financing to cover the needed infrastructure improvements. And the fans? The last time the A's were good (2019) they drew 54,000 fans to see them lose in the Wild Card game. That's 10,000 more fans than have ever witnessed a SF Giants playoff game in Pac Bell / AT&T / Oracle Ballpark.
This, of course, is due to Mount Davis (and other capacity) and not to the fanbase.
Don't take this the wrong way. I was literally in the house during the last real hurrah. I was in the seats underneath Mount Davis when Jeremy Giambi Didn't Slide and from out there I didn't understand why he didn't score. I was just too far away to see Jeter's amazing play play out. PUT THE RUN ON THE SCOREBOARD, I screamed, to the void. There was no run. No run was scored.
Any playoff game will fill the seats available. The available seats in PhoneCo are about 10K fewer than the available seats in the Craptasticolloseum. Those seats are tarped over in April. But in the postseason, they sell, of course.
Don't take this the wrong way. I was literally in the house during the last real hurrah. I was in the seats underneath Mount Davis when Jeremy Giambi Didn't Slide and from out there I didn't understand why he didn't score. I was just too far away to see Jeter's amazing play play out. PUT THE RUN ON THE SCOREBOARD, I screamed, to the void. There was no run. No run was scored.
Any playoff game will fill the seats available. The available seats in PhoneCo are about 10K fewer than the available seats in the Craptasticolloseum. Those seats are tarped over in April. But in the postseason, they sell, of course.
My point wasn't that the A's have more fans than the Giants -- clearly we all know that's not true. I was simply pointing out that even with a larger capacity stadium, the A's are capable of selling out their stadium when the product on the field warrants excitement. The owner is crying poor and claiming that he is unable to field a competitive team in Oakland because the fans don't show up. That is verifiably not true.
When the A's had marquee players and a top payroll in the 80s and early 90s, they were kicking the Giants butts in attendance so hard that the Giants were going to move to Tampa Bay. John Fisher (a lifelong Giants fan) was part of the group that helped to save the Giants and keep them in San Francisco. Coincidentally he then sold his minority stake in the Giants in 2005 when he bought the A's and has been working to move them out of Oakland ever since.
When the A's had marquee players and a top payroll in the 80s and early 90s, they were kicking the Giants butts in attendance so hard that the Giants were going to move to Tampa Bay. John Fisher (a lifelong Giants fan) was part of the group that helped to save the Giants and keep them in San Francisco. Coincidentally he then sold his minority stake in the Giants in 2005 when he bought the A's and has been working to move them out of Oakland ever since.
Mostly because Vegas in the summer is hot as hell and part of Fisher's big "Move to Vegas" promo package was the idea that they were going to build an air conditioned retractable dome stadium on the Tropicana site despite him not having close to enough money for that and the site being way too small for that to happen.
Probably more importantly, I'm pretty sure the players union would raise hell if everyone was forced to play in a AAA stadium in one of the hottest regions on the entire planet during the summer and Manfred, while being the worst commissioner in pro sports by a wide mile, is smart enough to know he doesn't want that.
Probably more importantly, I'm pretty sure the players union would raise hell if everyone was forced to play in a AAA stadium in one of the hottest regions on the entire planet during the summer and Manfred, while being the worst commissioner in pro sports by a wide mile, is smart enough to know he doesn't want that.
Gotcha.. Sac gets pretty hot too though. I had lived in Vegas for a bit and the summer seems to last a lot longer, but both Sac and Vegas can get you those 110+ days. I hope we get it though. It will be fun, and hopefully show the MLB that we could easily support the team. I found it weird that Las Vegas is getting teams because their media market is really small. I guess in the age of the internet, as long as you put the teams in a place where there are enough people to sell out the arena/stadium then that's all that matters. But it's kind of crappy that a place like Las Vegas is getting all these teams before Sacramento does.
Feel bad for A’s fans that this is happening but it seems like they’re moving to Vegas regardless of what happens from 2025-27. I’m as casual a baseball “fan” as you can be, but would definitely be into the Sacramento A’s for however long they stay here.
If I was Vivek, I would ask Manfred/Fisher for a guarantee that if the Vegas deal falls through, the A’s would stay in Sacramento permanently though.
Sacramento has grown quite a lot the last few years and could definitely support two major teams imo. Look at the list of cities across the country that have 2-4 major pro sports teams, it’s crazy that we only have one team.
If I was Vivek, I would ask Manfred/Fisher for a guarantee that if the Vegas deal falls through, the A’s would stay in Sacramento permanently though.
Sacramento has grown quite a lot the last few years and could definitely support two major teams imo. Look at the list of cities across the country that have 2-4 major pro sports teams, it’s crazy that we only have one team.
No, I’m not. You’re the one not living in 2024, let alone this millennium. That’s why you’re talking about 30+ years ago.
Too much emotional bias from most of you that are fans of these Bay area teams. You’re just not able to remain objective. Or avoid moving goalposts.
I’ve been religiously following the NFL and MLB since I was 6. I’ve lived in NorCal for over 53 years now. I’ve seen and experienced a lot. There’s nothing you’re going to teach me about any of these franchises or their fans. I’ve seen and lived through it. I’m not some youngster talking about things I only heard or read about. I’m fully aware of the A’s (and Raiders and Niners and Giants) histories and their fanbases.
Having said that, the A’s fanbase today and in recent years is not what it was during the 70’s or 80’s or even the 90’s. Furthermore, the city of Oakland has been crumbling to the ground for decades and has reached a point where it is essentially a lost cause.
Proof is in the super high crime rates and the fact that the likes of Denny’s and In and Out (which never closed a store before) are closing up shop there. People like you seem to wanna ignore major factors like that, along with the “not even remotely close to what it was fanbase”. More power to you. Go ahead and bury your head if you so choose, but I won’t join you.
So, yes, 1000% I stand by what I stated. The A’s situation of TODAY is COMPLETELY different than the KINGS situation. Or the Sonics. If you cannot recognize that, that’s on you.
Lastly, even if any of the things I’ve stated were untrue (they aren’t) — it doesn’t change the first point I made. SAC temporarily hosting the A’s is not going to change anything. Unless Vegas or the A’s ownership has a huge change or heart, they are leaving Oakland. And regardless whether they somehow miraculously find a path to remain in Oakland or eventually end up in Vegas (or Nashville or some place else), the temporary location they opt to play will have nothing to do with it. That’s a truth some of you seem to be selectively ignoring.
It’s not the same thing as the Seattle group trying to steal the KINGS and Seattle fans not having sympathy or empathy for KINGS fans. Carmichael Dave or anyone else making that comparison are completely missing the mark. I could expound further and provide a longer list of reasons why but I fear it would be a complete waste of time. If you can’t see the differences already, there’s really no convincing you.
You can say I’m wrong all you want. It’s not changing reality. Nor is any weak counter argument you’re going to grasp at straws to construct.
As you were.
Too much emotional bias from most of you that are fans of these Bay area teams. You’re just not able to remain objective. Or avoid moving goalposts.
I’ve been religiously following the NFL and MLB since I was 6. I’ve lived in NorCal for over 53 years now. I’ve seen and experienced a lot. There’s nothing you’re going to teach me about any of these franchises or their fans. I’ve seen and lived through it. I’m not some youngster talking about things I only heard or read about. I’m fully aware of the A’s (and Raiders and Niners and Giants) histories and their fanbases.
Having said that, the A’s fanbase today and in recent years is not what it was during the 70’s or 80’s or even the 90’s. Furthermore, the city of Oakland has been crumbling to the ground for decades and has reached a point where it is essentially a lost cause.
Proof is in the super high crime rates and the fact that the likes of Denny’s and In and Out (which never closed a store before) are closing up shop there. People like you seem to wanna ignore major factors like that, along with the “not even remotely close to what it was fanbase”. More power to you. Go ahead and bury your head if you so choose, but I won’t join you.
So, yes, 1000% I stand by what I stated. The A’s situation of TODAY is COMPLETELY different than the KINGS situation. Or the Sonics. If you cannot recognize that, that’s on you.
Lastly, even if any of the things I’ve stated were untrue (they aren’t) — it doesn’t change the first point I made. SAC temporarily hosting the A’s is not going to change anything. Unless Vegas or the A’s ownership has a huge change or heart, they are leaving Oakland. And regardless whether they somehow miraculously find a path to remain in Oakland or eventually end up in Vegas (or Nashville or some place else), the temporary location they opt to play will have nothing to do with it. That’s a truth some of you seem to be selectively ignoring.
It’s not the same thing as the Seattle group trying to steal the KINGS and Seattle fans not having sympathy or empathy for KINGS fans. Carmichael Dave or anyone else making that comparison are completely missing the mark. I could expound further and provide a longer list of reasons why but I fear it would be a complete waste of time. If you can’t see the differences already, there’s really no convincing you.
You can say I’m wrong all you want. It’s not changing reality. Nor is any weak counter argument you’re going to grasp at straws to construct.
As you were.
This is realistic take. It’s almost assuredly because you are a self-described “casual fan”. These others are overly emotional and/or biased. It’s clouding their ability to remain rational.
Absolutely, I feel bad for all A’s fans and all upstanding Oakland area residents. But unfortunately there just aren’t enough of them anymore AND their city is far too mismanaged and likely past the point of return to prevent it from happening. They certainly deserved better ownership, no doubt, but none of that could or would have changed the current state of that city or the surrounding areas. The Raiders and Warriors left. Now major businesses are doing the same. Why should the A’s be any different, mismanaged or not?
People representing as if the city of SAC would somehow be sabotaging Oakland or actively stealing their team by hosting them temporarily is beyond ludicrous. It’s either disingenuous or just flat out ignorant. Choose one.
The only things comparable between the KINGS and A’s situations is that they both involve a professional sports team potentially leaving one location for another. And they both have/had poor ownership. But that’s where the comparisons end.
There are more differences than similarities. Which is why those making counter arguments are talking about 30 years ago rather than current times. I can vividly remember 49ers games being blacked out in the mid-to-late 70’s with super low attendance at ”the Stick” until the team struck lightning in 1981 — but that surely doesn’t represent what’s gone on since or more importantly in current times, does it?
I hadn’t thought about this. I think you’re spot on. They absolutely should try to get that type of contingency/fallback agreement.
If the A’s are for sure to leave the sinkhole of Oakland, IMO it’d be much better for them to remain within earshot of the East Bay and Central Valley where they’ll still have a decent fanbase to go along with all their new fans. It surely doesn’t benefit NorCal for the A’s to end up in Vegas, Nashville, Salt Lake or Portland.
If Oakland could magically fix all their issues, of course that’s where they should be. But living in current reality, SAC should be every concerned NorCal fans #1 alternative to Vegas or elsewhere out of State. Even if only temporarily.
Regardless where they eventually end up, the next thing to address is getting that $#/tty owner to sell to someone that can and wants to properly run that franchise. One step at a time, though.
Absolutely, I feel bad for all A’s fans and all upstanding Oakland area residents. But unfortunately there just aren’t enough of them anymore AND their city is far too mismanaged and likely past the point of return to prevent it from happening. They certainly deserved better ownership, no doubt, but none of that could or would have changed the current state of that city or the surrounding areas. The Raiders and Warriors left. Now major businesses are doing the same. Why should the A’s be any different, mismanaged or not?
People representing as if the city of SAC would somehow be sabotaging Oakland or actively stealing their team by hosting them temporarily is beyond ludicrous. It’s either disingenuous or just flat out ignorant. Choose one.
The only things comparable between the KINGS and A’s situations is that they both involve a professional sports team potentially leaving one location for another. And they both have/had poor ownership. But that’s where the comparisons end.
There are more differences than similarities. Which is why those making counter arguments are talking about 30 years ago rather than current times. I can vividly remember 49ers games being blacked out in the mid-to-late 70’s with super low attendance at ”the Stick” until the team struck lightning in 1981 — but that surely doesn’t represent what’s gone on since or more importantly in current times, does it?
I hadn’t thought about this. I think you’re spot on. They absolutely should try to get that type of contingency/fallback agreement.
If the A’s are for sure to leave the sinkhole of Oakland, IMO it’d be much better for them to remain within earshot of the East Bay and Central Valley where they’ll still have a decent fanbase to go along with all their new fans. It surely doesn’t benefit NorCal for the A’s to end up in Vegas, Nashville, Salt Lake or Portland.
If Oakland could magically fix all their issues, of course that’s where they should be. But living in current reality, SAC should be every concerned NorCal fans #1 alternative to Vegas or elsewhere out of State. Even if only temporarily.
Regardless where they eventually end up, the next thing to address is getting that $#/tty owner to sell to someone that can and wants to properly run that franchise. One step at a time, though.
I don’t think the City of Oakland bashing is warranted. Oakland still has a bunch of great things happening and is one of the most vibrant multi-cultural cities on the West Coast. It definitely has more than its fair share of problems, but I don’t think choosing not to subsidize professional sports stadiums is a metric for social decline.
I mean - the Warriors Stadium was still getting great attendance because they had a good product. But a rich dude wanted a stadium in SF, and he paid to make that happen.
I mean - the Warriors Stadium was still getting great attendance because they had a good product. But a rich dude wanted a stadium in SF, and he paid to make that happen.
I'm talking about 30 years ago because believe it or not, that was the last time an owner of the A's actually spent money on the team beyond the bare minimum required of them by MLB. I think it's relevant to this current conversation that the last time the A's had a payroll which indicated an interest from the front office in fielding a competitive team -- they were outselling all but two teams in the sport. What happened since then?
*Walter Haas died in 1995 and the team was sold to Steve Schott -- whose first act as owner was to demand the front office cut payroll. Everybody of value was traded (most notably Dennis Eckersley and Mark McGwire both going to the Cardinals in 1996 and 1997 respectively).
*As chronicled in the book/movie Moneyball, throughout the late 90s and early 2000s Steve Schott's A's were run like a small market franchise and once again traded their stars before they ever actually had to pay them in free agency (goodbye Jason Giambi, Miguel Tejada, Mark Mulder and Tim Hudson).
*Until 2005 when John Fisher bought the team and managing partner Lew Wolff announced a year later that they were leaving Oakland and moving to Fremont. (Somehow in 2004 while the team was in the process of being sold, Billy Beane managed to get Eric Chavez re-signed for 6 years and $66 million. Presumably because Steve Schott already knew he was selling and wouldn't have to pay that money anyway and the soon to be owner was not actually in charge yet and had no say in the matter. This is still, 20 years later, the largest contract in Oakland A's history. **The largest contract John Fisher has ever signed off on in nearly 20 years as owner was a 2 year extension for Khris Davis for $33.5 million of which he paid almost nothing because the 2020 season was only 60 games (player contracts were prorated) and Khris Davis was traded before the 2021 season with the Texas Rangers absorbing his whole contract.
*The Fremont stadium plan went nowhere after multiple lawsuits were filed on behalf of the residents of Fremont. The City of Oakland proposed two sites: the Howard Terminal site on the waterfront or a new stadium at the Coliseum site. John and Lew instead announced a new stadium plan in downtown San Jose, despite the Giants now holding territorial rights to San Jose and the MLB owners refusing to allow those rights to change hands. John and Lew wanted San Jose bad enough that the city of San Jose appealed to the US Supreme Court on their behalf to overrule MLB's anti-trust exemption and allow them to move anyway. The US Supreme Court rejected their appeal.
*The San Francisco Giants, who were once days away from leaving California, now have the best ballpark in the Bay Area and win the World Series in 2010, 2012, and 2014. In 2015, after spending the first 15 years of their existence as the AAA affiliate of the Oakland A's, the Sacramento River Cats announce that they are switching their affiliation to the San Francisco Giants. The A's announce their new AAA affiliate as the Nashville Sounds (later changed to the La Vegas Aviators). Regional market share for the A's hits an all-time low.
*By 2015, with Fremont and San Jose plans scrapped, the A's announce they were now considering three different sites. (1) Howard Terminal -- on land owned by the city of Oakland. (2) The Coliseum site -- on land jointly owned by the Oakland A's and the city of Oakland. (3) The Peralta Community college site -- on land that neither the city of Oakland nor the Oakland A's owned. Which site do you think the genius business man John Fisher chose? In late 2017 the A's announced their plans to build a new stadium at the Peralta site. It took only a couple months of negotiation for the Peralta College Board to tell them to eff off.
*While all of this is happening the A's front office continues to trade every star player they have -- though now they're not waiting until they're a year from free agency, now they're trading them with multiple years of arbitration on their contracts and the potential future stars returning to Oakland in these deals are coming from further and further down their team's top prospect lists. The word is already out that the A's front office is required to trade these players by ownership and thus they have no leverage. As fans we are repeatedly told that they will surely start spending money as soon as they get a new stadium. The same promise they have now made to the city of Las Vegas.
*If you chart these repeated fire sales, team attendance has gone up every time the team is winning -- peaking around 9th or 10th in the AL before the front office cuts the teams legs off, trades everybody, and it plummets back down again. Unfortunately when the life span of any given collection of players between each rebuilding cycle is only 4-5 years, it's hard to generate much momentum and with every fire sale the trust fans have in this front office and owner takes a hit.
*In 2020, with the A's coming off back-to-back 97 win seasons and attendance once again on the rise, Covid cuts the season short. John Fisher is the only owner in MLB who uses this national state of emergency as an excuse to not pay any of his minor league players -- until pressure from basically everyone in baseball forces him to "change his mind". Hometown hero Marcus Semien plays his last game with the Oakland A's in front of no fans as the A's lose a playoff series to the Houston Astros in an empty Dodger Stadium.
*While negotiating the terms of a new stadium at Howard Terminal with the city of Oakland, Fisher mandates another fire sale in 2022 with Matt Chapman, Matt Olson, and Sean Murphy all leaving in trades for B level prospects. As this is happening, season ticket prices are nearly doubled with predictable results. John Fisher announces his deal for land in Las Vegas in early 2023, stunning the mayor of Oakland who thought they were days away from making a binding agreement to build a new stadium at the Howard Terminal site.
Since you're so plugged in, I'm not telling you anything you don't already know but I do think it's worth spelling out the long sad history of this march toward re-location because most of the general sports fans here have not been following all of this and are probably prone to being misled by all of the blatant lies coming from John Fisher and the commissioner of MLB about how sad that they are that they now have to leave Oakland behind to continue to survive as a baseball franchise.
Since you deign to call me out of touch, have you actually been to an Oakland A's game in the last 10 years or are you just reading whatever is written about the A's in the news? Of course I'm emotional about the A's moving out of Oakland. Of course I'm biased. This is my team. Oakland (technically Richmond) is where I'm from. And I'm not selectively ignoring anything. John Fisher is so completely inept that he has not yet figured out a plan for where his team is going to play for the next 3 year nor has he shown evidence that they actually have a stadium plan in place at the Tropicana site let alone financing for it or shovels in the ground. MLB gave them a deadline of January 15th -- over a month ago -- to have all of this finalized and over a month later they still can't get their act together.
So yeah, I'm going to keep hoping there's a chance until there's no chance. You wishing the team moves to Sacramento for the next 3 years doesn't actually bother me at all (despite the blatant hypocrisy). You are your own person, you can wish for whatever you like. I just don't appreciate you spouting off a bunch of ignorant BS and then signing off in the most condescending way possible. You clearly have no idea what you're talking about -- regarding the city of Oakland or the fans of the Oakland A's.
*Walter Haas died in 1995 and the team was sold to Steve Schott -- whose first act as owner was to demand the front office cut payroll. Everybody of value was traded (most notably Dennis Eckersley and Mark McGwire both going to the Cardinals in 1996 and 1997 respectively).
*As chronicled in the book/movie Moneyball, throughout the late 90s and early 2000s Steve Schott's A's were run like a small market franchise and once again traded their stars before they ever actually had to pay them in free agency (goodbye Jason Giambi, Miguel Tejada, Mark Mulder and Tim Hudson).
*Until 2005 when John Fisher bought the team and managing partner Lew Wolff announced a year later that they were leaving Oakland and moving to Fremont. (Somehow in 2004 while the team was in the process of being sold, Billy Beane managed to get Eric Chavez re-signed for 6 years and $66 million. Presumably because Steve Schott already knew he was selling and wouldn't have to pay that money anyway and the soon to be owner was not actually in charge yet and had no say in the matter. This is still, 20 years later, the largest contract in Oakland A's history. **The largest contract John Fisher has ever signed off on in nearly 20 years as owner was a 2 year extension for Khris Davis for $33.5 million of which he paid almost nothing because the 2020 season was only 60 games (player contracts were prorated) and Khris Davis was traded before the 2021 season with the Texas Rangers absorbing his whole contract.
*The Fremont stadium plan went nowhere after multiple lawsuits were filed on behalf of the residents of Fremont. The City of Oakland proposed two sites: the Howard Terminal site on the waterfront or a new stadium at the Coliseum site. John and Lew instead announced a new stadium plan in downtown San Jose, despite the Giants now holding territorial rights to San Jose and the MLB owners refusing to allow those rights to change hands. John and Lew wanted San Jose bad enough that the city of San Jose appealed to the US Supreme Court on their behalf to overrule MLB's anti-trust exemption and allow them to move anyway. The US Supreme Court rejected their appeal.
*The San Francisco Giants, who were once days away from leaving California, now have the best ballpark in the Bay Area and win the World Series in 2010, 2012, and 2014. In 2015, after spending the first 15 years of their existence as the AAA affiliate of the Oakland A's, the Sacramento River Cats announce that they are switching their affiliation to the San Francisco Giants. The A's announce their new AAA affiliate as the Nashville Sounds (later changed to the La Vegas Aviators). Regional market share for the A's hits an all-time low.
*By 2015, with Fremont and San Jose plans scrapped, the A's announce they were now considering three different sites. (1) Howard Terminal -- on land owned by the city of Oakland. (2) The Coliseum site -- on land jointly owned by the Oakland A's and the city of Oakland. (3) The Peralta Community college site -- on land that neither the city of Oakland nor the Oakland A's owned. Which site do you think the genius business man John Fisher chose? In late 2017 the A's announced their plans to build a new stadium at the Peralta site. It took only a couple months of negotiation for the Peralta College Board to tell them to eff off.
*While all of this is happening the A's front office continues to trade every star player they have -- though now they're not waiting until they're a year from free agency, now they're trading them with multiple years of arbitration on their contracts and the potential future stars returning to Oakland in these deals are coming from further and further down their team's top prospect lists. The word is already out that the A's front office is required to trade these players by ownership and thus they have no leverage. As fans we are repeatedly told that they will surely start spending money as soon as they get a new stadium. The same promise they have now made to the city of Las Vegas.
*If you chart these repeated fire sales, team attendance has gone up every time the team is winning -- peaking around 9th or 10th in the AL before the front office cuts the teams legs off, trades everybody, and it plummets back down again. Unfortunately when the life span of any given collection of players between each rebuilding cycle is only 4-5 years, it's hard to generate much momentum and with every fire sale the trust fans have in this front office and owner takes a hit.
*In 2020, with the A's coming off back-to-back 97 win seasons and attendance once again on the rise, Covid cuts the season short. John Fisher is the only owner in MLB who uses this national state of emergency as an excuse to not pay any of his minor league players -- until pressure from basically everyone in baseball forces him to "change his mind". Hometown hero Marcus Semien plays his last game with the Oakland A's in front of no fans as the A's lose a playoff series to the Houston Astros in an empty Dodger Stadium.
*While negotiating the terms of a new stadium at Howard Terminal with the city of Oakland, Fisher mandates another fire sale in 2022 with Matt Chapman, Matt Olson, and Sean Murphy all leaving in trades for B level prospects. As this is happening, season ticket prices are nearly doubled with predictable results. John Fisher announces his deal for land in Las Vegas in early 2023, stunning the mayor of Oakland who thought they were days away from making a binding agreement to build a new stadium at the Howard Terminal site.
Since you're so plugged in, I'm not telling you anything you don't already know but I do think it's worth spelling out the long sad history of this march toward re-location because most of the general sports fans here have not been following all of this and are probably prone to being misled by all of the blatant lies coming from John Fisher and the commissioner of MLB about how sad that they are that they now have to leave Oakland behind to continue to survive as a baseball franchise.
Since you deign to call me out of touch, have you actually been to an Oakland A's game in the last 10 years or are you just reading whatever is written about the A's in the news? Of course I'm emotional about the A's moving out of Oakland. Of course I'm biased. This is my team. Oakland (technically Richmond) is where I'm from. And I'm not selectively ignoring anything. John Fisher is so completely inept that he has not yet figured out a plan for where his team is going to play for the next 3 year nor has he shown evidence that they actually have a stadium plan in place at the Tropicana site let alone financing for it or shovels in the ground. MLB gave them a deadline of January 15th -- over a month ago -- to have all of this finalized and over a month later they still can't get their act together.
So yeah, I'm going to keep hoping there's a chance until there's no chance. You wishing the team moves to Sacramento for the next 3 years doesn't actually bother me at all (despite the blatant hypocrisy). You are your own person, you can wish for whatever you like. I just don't appreciate you spouting off a bunch of ignorant BS and then signing off in the most condescending way possible. You clearly have no idea what you're talking about -- regarding the city of Oakland or the fans of the Oakland A's.
Definitely. We are the biggest TV market (#20) without at least two teams. And Vegas is #40 media market and they are going to have 3 teams now. We have a lot of areas which have a way lower TV viewership, yet we keep getting the shaft.. If they lumped us in with the bay area up to Reno we would be in the top 10.
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Won't the Giants try to claim Sacramento as part of their territory, kinda like what they did with San Jose? The Giants want the A's out of NorCAL so they can claim the entire region as their own.
Sacramento could have supported the A's AND Raiders 30 years ago, if we had just a bit more luck on our side. Ill never forget the March On Baseball. Sacramento took over the oakland coliseum for an A's/Yankees game and it was spectacular. The coliseum was full, lower and upper deck, with sacramento fans dressed in blue shirts, chanting throughout the game. If i remember correctly, it was bat day. Yes youngsters, baseball teams use to give away full size bats to fans as they walked into the game! The trip from sac and back to was just an endless sea of buses carrying hopeful Sacramento baseball fans partying and making their love of baseball known. If given the chance, this city will take MLB by storm. I have no doubt whatsoever.
Sacramento could have supported the A's AND Raiders 30 years ago, if we had just a bit more luck on our side. Ill never forget the March On Baseball. Sacramento took over the oakland coliseum for an A's/Yankees game and it was spectacular. The coliseum was full, lower and upper deck, with sacramento fans dressed in blue shirts, chanting throughout the game. If i remember correctly, it was bat day. Yes youngsters, baseball teams use to give away full size bats to fans as they walked into the game! The trip from sac and back to was just an endless sea of buses carrying hopeful Sacramento baseball fans partying and making their love of baseball known. If given the chance, this city will take MLB by storm. I have no doubt whatsoever.
I believe Sacramento is considered joint territory for Giants and A’s. Or neither have claim to it. Both are available to watch on NBC Bay Area. A’s were on Sacramento radio until last season. Both had their farm systems here. They won’t have much of a say anyway unless there is a later expansion/separate relocation effort to Sacramento.
Giants didn’t just up and claim San Jose. Giants do have territorial rights to San Jose because the A’s actually ceded it to them in the early 90’s to help build San Francisco’s case for the Giants not to be relocated to Tampa Bay.
So it makes it a little sad that the Giants would later use that favor that helped the Giants stay in SF to block a potential avenue for the A’s to stay in the Bay Area. Different owners though.
Giants didn’t just up and claim San Jose. Giants do have territorial rights to San Jose because the A’s actually ceded it to them in the early 90’s to help build San Francisco’s case for the Giants not to be relocated to Tampa Bay.
So it makes it a little sad that the Giants would later use that favor that helped the Giants stay in SF to block a potential avenue for the A’s to stay in the Bay Area. Different owners though.
This whole situation sucks and not living in Sacramento I'm not really in position to support/withhold support from Fisher either way, but there's several crappy things going on here. One Fisher is a POS, @hrdboild has fairly chronicled the A's fall off since the Tony LaRussa and Bash Bros era and the very existence of Moneyball is something they should be embarrassed by. Two, the Giants have been a-holes in this. Both teams exist in the Bay and have their loyal fanbases and will always attract fair weather fans as well. This works well for just about every other major metro in the USA and of course in the rest of the world many leagues are entirely consolidated around 2-3 cities with promotion and relegation on top of that. I'd call myself a Giants fan after the Red Sox, but F the Giants here.
MLB are the worst here. They should tell their broke/cheap a$$ owners to pony up not facilitate a move to Vegas. Also let's stop moving sports to Vegas. How can we not see how big a problem gambling partnerships are becoming. They should just deny a move especially since there are forces in Oakland willing to play ball with the hostage negotiating tactics. Is Oakland the most beautiful city in the world? No. No they aren't. Is Oakland like all of the bigger West Coast cities forced by local politics to entertain the failings of the country at large, yes they are. No more needs to be said about that.
From my vantage point Sac should be allowed to host the A's for a few years with the intention of them moving back to Oakland. In return Sacramento should be granted the rights to host a future team without objection by the A's and Giants franchises. If the A's have to move from Oakland because after 3-4 years the deal falls through, Sacramento seems like at least you are keeping the team in the region and while its not convenient for fans living in Oakland it will allow them to keep a large part of their fanbase intact. I don't think this is a Kings to SoCal, Seattle, Vegas, or Virginia Beach thing but I also don't think it is an ideal outcome, it should be the last resort with Utah and Las Vegas not even on the table.
Also if Fisher can't produce a solid plan by the end of the 2024 MLB season he should be forced to sell.
MLB are the worst here. They should tell their broke/cheap a$$ owners to pony up not facilitate a move to Vegas. Also let's stop moving sports to Vegas. How can we not see how big a problem gambling partnerships are becoming. They should just deny a move especially since there are forces in Oakland willing to play ball with the hostage negotiating tactics. Is Oakland the most beautiful city in the world? No. No they aren't. Is Oakland like all of the bigger West Coast cities forced by local politics to entertain the failings of the country at large, yes they are. No more needs to be said about that.
From my vantage point Sac should be allowed to host the A's for a few years with the intention of them moving back to Oakland. In return Sacramento should be granted the rights to host a future team without objection by the A's and Giants franchises. If the A's have to move from Oakland because after 3-4 years the deal falls through, Sacramento seems like at least you are keeping the team in the region and while its not convenient for fans living in Oakland it will allow them to keep a large part of their fanbase intact. I don't think this is a Kings to SoCal, Seattle, Vegas, or Virginia Beach thing but I also don't think it is an ideal outcome, it should be the last resort with Utah and Las Vegas not even on the table.
Also if Fisher can't produce a solid plan by the end of the 2024 MLB season he should be forced to sell.
