But as you know, Kawhi Leonard has nothing to do with the Robinson pick.Originally Posted by JB_kings
In the K Leonard draft I wanted Kemba Walker, and very close behind him I wanted Brandon Knight; didn't see Leonard in college. Just like most on this board, I was very dissapointed in the Jimmer/Salmons draft and trade.
I
Kawhi instead of Jimmer.
All in all you're just another brick in the wall. - Pink Floyd
He was a player drafted on his potential to get his team numbers but he was drafted to a team where he'll never get a chance to play enough to produce those numbers.
I AM ON STRIKE!!!! 01-30-06 to ???
"If the effort is there. The winning will take care of itself." - Nostradumbass
i actually wanted the Kings to take Leonard last year and not Jimmer. before the draft happened. and this year i wanted either Lillard or Barnes.
even Kemba Walker instead of Jimmer would have made this team leaps and bounds better.
but to answer the OP's question. i think T-Rob is falling victim to lack of roles like every other player on this team
I think he's actually one of the few guys who has found a role.
In the summer league/preseason/first few games he was falling victim to lack of roles, and lack of non-roleplayer skills. Once he settled back into a role he's been solid enough. In the preseason he shot 16-42 .381 trying to do too much. Trying to create on his own. Over the last 6 games as he has settled back to run' n jump roleplayer taking catches and trying to finish them around the rim, he's shot 16-29 .552. We're not getting consistent rebounding or defense from him yet, but offensively he has quit hurting us and is sticking to the things his athleticism allows him to do. i..e he's doing a pretty good imiation of a roleplayer.
Really I think that's why our frontcourt is a lot closer to being solid than our little guys. Up front we have one Cousisn, and now 3 guys who are playing their roles pretty well in JT, Hayes and TRob. Put that together and its solid. We need to swap one of those guys for a shotblocker, but at least it makes sense basketballwise. The problem is at the little people spots where Petrie has accumualted, and Smart has coached at least 7 different guys who fight the roleplayer designation, and only 2 largely scrubs at this point who fit it (Cisco and Outlaw).
Last edited by Bricklayer; 11-19-2012 at 03:40 PM.
"All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident." -- Arthur Schopenhauer
"Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocrities." --Albert Einstein
"Petrie signings are more akin to the splash you get when you accidentally drop your toothbrush in the toilet. " -- swisshh
he may have found a roll but i think if this team were to ever get a coach who can figure out how to manage rolls/rotations, so that the rest of the team has rolls, T-Rob would be much better off. players who are used to playing with him would be setting him up for ally oops all the time and also if the team could start getting out and running more he will benefit
The criticism of Thomas Robinson at the time of the draft was that he was a little bit undersized for a PF (but hopefully would make up for it with athleticism) and didn't have any elite skills (aside from rebounding which doesn't always translate to the NBA). It's too early to say but at this point he hasn't been able to adjust to how physical the NBA game is in the paint. He's not establishing position down low so other people are just going around him to get the rebounds. But it's rare for someone to step in and dominate from day one like Blake Griffin did a couple years ago. Next to Cousins, I can see him being a weapon off of pick and rolls eventually because he's so mobile -- the same role that Amare performed with great success in Phoenix.
I never thought of him as an elite player in the NBA. His ceiling is solid starter at PF. The results so far are not encouraging, but I think he has the physical attributes to play the position. It's been trending smaller for the last 10 years anyway. Someone is going to have to chase K. Love and Melo all over the floor and he's the type of guy who can do that. I think he's really going to have to focus on his help defense though because he's way out of position most of the time right now and that's where he could have the most impact right away with, ahem, better coaching.
Defense matters.
this is very true, only problem is for that to happen we would need a coach that actually runs any type of offense at all. there are more Pick N Rolls performed at pick up games during lunch break at a middle school
I don't know what makes you think that. Rebounding almost always translates to the NBA. Good college rebounders turn into good pro rebounders, and poor college rebounders turn into poor pro rebounders. To my understanding it is the single most translatable stat.
And there's the rub. Get a middle school coach in here and have them run pick and roll every play and we're already a better team. It worked for Mike Bibby's Kings. With the right players it's still the hardest play to guard in basketball.
Yes and no. In general I would agree with you -- if you have a wing player who averages a lot of rebounds in college they will probably also average a lot of rebounds in the NBA, provided they get enough playing time. But there's a critical point at which the height factor starts to skew the stats. Most college teams have one player who is tall enough to play PF in the NBA. The elite teams will have two or maybe three. That means that you don't necessarily need good technique to rack up rebounds in the college game if you're at or near that 6'9" cut off point. Size isn't necessarily a good indicator of rebounding prowess. But you do need to have technique -- reading the angles, getting in good position, boxing out, pursuing loose balls relentlessly. If you're a player who relies on size rather than technique in college, than you might have a problem transitioning to the NBA game where size will be negated. Michael Beasley and David West are recent examples. Elite rebounders in college, nothing special in the NBA.
But I don't really think those criticisms apply to Thomas Robinson. He played next to a 7 footer and he played against top level competition and he led the entire NCAA in defensive rebounds by a wide margin. I think he just needs time. He'll learn to slow down and play to his strengths.
Last edited by hrdboild; 11-19-2012 at 04:45 PM.
Defense matters.
Correct
All in all you're just another brick in the wall. - Pink Floyd
Whether someone likes or dislikes T. Robb, he's hardly the reason the team is struggling, and I agree with you, he along with JT and Hayes has settled into a role. One of his problems at Kansas is that for his first two years he played behind the Morris twins. I think that lack of playing time hurt his development to some extent. As a result, his post game was comprised of using his athleticism to out quick other players. That can work to some degree in the NBA if your 6'10" and weight 250, but not if your 6'8.75" and weigh 235. Because your trying to out quick the 6'10" 250 player that, in some cases, is just as quick as your are,
He does have some attributes that in the future should help him. He's a very good ballhandler for a player his size. He also has a good feel for the passing game. Unfortunately, right now both those attributes are at times his worse enemy. But once he learns how to use them properly, along with his outstanding athleticism, he could end up being a very good player. I've said from the beginning that I saw a lot of SF in him, and I still think that it could be his destination. He has decent form on his jumpshot, and good range as well. If he can become a good jumpshooter, I can see him being one of the better two way SF's in the league,.
Lest anyone forget, Kahwai Leonard played PF at San Diego St. James Johnson played PF in college as well. So its not that big a reach to project T. Robb to that position. If so, he would go from being an average sized/undersized PF, to being one of the bigger SF's in the league. However, none of this is going to happen overnight. The way it looks right now, were going to add yet more youth in the lottery next offseason. What this team needs is some veteran help. Not just the John Salmons kind of veteran help, but the Chris Webber kind of veteran help.
How much better do you think this team would be if you suddenly added Tim Duncan to the mix. No, I'm not suggesting we trade for Tim Duncan. I'm sure he'll retire with the Spurs. But we need someone like that, who even the Cousins and the Evans of the world will look up to and listen to.
Its hard to have a battle of wits with an unarmed person.
Hard work beats talent, when talent doesn't work hard.
And this is what I'm most disappointed with Robinson about - he doesn't box out. For such a good rebounder it's just weird to see him never box out his man. That and for a guy with his athleticism he rarely ever contests shots at the rim.
I guess he could become a Paul Milsap type player if he ever reaches his potential... His offense would have too get WAYYYYYY better to reach that ceiling tho.... I would of prefered us drafting drummond.. but whatever.. im "meh" on the whole robinson thing. Im not impressed by the pick and im not too dissapointed.
We Need Defense!!
[facepalm] Note to self. Never try to help others understand posts by Section 101 ever again. [/facepalm]
LoL thanks.
All in all you're just another brick in the wall. - Pink Floyd
Anyone we drafted will get screwed. If MJ was on this team, he be screwed as well. No $$$ for a good coach = no development for any player.
He's not getting much of a chance in Smart's rotation. Neither is Jimmer. T-Rob will be a stud, he just needs PT to develop in the NBA.
Lets see, most NBA ready player in the draft and then comes in and looks completely lost. I'd say it's the coach, although I feel bad for hating on Smart. Plus he's on a team with a bunch of shot happy guards. Not like he can really get too many opportunities on pick and rolls/pops where he would do well and we don't run much so he's screwed there also. He is a good player. I think we need a better coach.
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